Bulgaria set to introduce free visas
ogromna glupost e toa bidejki so sigurnost ke vovedat sistem na izdavanje direktno na granica!!!
pa sprema toa nema da imam potreba da idam od Kriva Palanka do Bitola za da zemam besplatno livche i da patuvam za Kjustendil.
reciprocitet i vednash voveduvanje na vizi za bugarite od MK strana!!!
mozhat da vovedat bezvizen rezhim kako megju DE i CRO na primer, ama bugarsko si e bugarsko! bez lazhenje i izmama nemozhat da opstanat!!!
znachi ako uspeeme da dobieme data ke bide izlishno seto ova.sepak imame ushte 4+ meseca do 2007.
inaku za bugarite seushte ne se znae dali ke vlezat od 01.01. i ima shansa da im odlozhat za 2008.do 2008 sum siguren deka ke dobieme data i olesnet rezhim bidejki megju prvite voveduvame biometrichni pasoshi.
drugata rabota e deka bugarite nema nikogash da go zatvorat "centarot" vo Bitola ako uspeat da go otvorat.
se` e toa isplanirana rezhija od bugarska strana.
mnogu e jasno deka ne im se isplati otvaranje na novi "centri" i voveduvanje na dopolnitelna birokratija koga na granica ke nudat isti "uslugi". treba da sum smotan ako potrosham povekje od 500m pat za da sredam prethodno rabota vo centarot na BG-DS koga na granica i onaka ke chmaam i kisnam...ili mozhno e voveduvanje na sistematsko "maltretiranje i dremenje" za onie shto nemaat livche za da si go opravdaat bugarite postoenjeto na noviot propaganden centar.
mislam deka navistina ke se raboti za nekakvo dodatno livche ili kartonche shto ke go davaat (kako kaj onie shto vleguvaat so avtomobil vo BG) bidejki ako lepat viza vo pasosh tie ke gi ispolepat 30-te strani za mnogu kratok period.
shto bi znachelo toa?
ako lepat vizi, pasoshite bi bile za brzo vreme popolneti i nevazhechki so shto lugjeto ,koi chesto patuvaat ili moraat da patuvaat za BG, bi bile izlozheni na dodatni troshoci za nova patna isprava.osobeno lugjeto vo pogranichnite regioni ,shto chesto odat i trguvaat, bi bile primorani ili da se maltretiraat po MK-sluzbi za novi dokumenti koi ke bidat mnogu poskapi (poradi noviot standart...mislam nakaj 50evra se zbori) ili zimanje na bugarski pasosh shto mnogukratno ke ja olesni,poeftini i ubrza celata pogranichna procedura na MK-patnici.
sepak,mislam deka bugarite ke vovedat "viza-kartonche" ispolneto so penkalce bidejki se skrzhavi i drebnichavi po surat i sigurno nema da troshat povekje od krajno potrebniot minimum.
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| Originally posted by toni_a ako MK dobie data za pregovori,te. ako segasnive se potrudat malku...togash na MK ke i padne vizniot rezhim isto kako kaj site zemji kandidati do sega. znachi ako uspeeme da dobieme data ke bide izlishno seto ova.sepak imame ushte 4+ meseca do 2007. |
Nope. Being a Candidate and having a date means NOTHING. For example, Turkey has both "conditions" but Turks need visas, and will need, for many years to go. The decision for lifting the Schengen visa regime need to be taken by all Schengen members (EU + Norway and Island). UK and Ireland are not part of the Schengen so they will keep the visas even when the EU lifts them. Currently, it seems that lifting the visa restrictions for the Western Balkans will take place b/n mid 2008 to mid 2009. There will ease the visa application process for you next year.
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inaku za bugarite seushte ne se znae dali ke vlezat od 01.01. i ima shansa da im odlozhat za 2008.do 2008 sum siguren deka ke dobieme data i olesnet rezhim bidejki megju prvite voveduvame biometrichni pasoshi. |
Nope. Bulgaria and Romania are de facto in the EU in 1 Jan. 2007. De jure a delay is possible, but extremely unlikey and everybody knows it will not take place. Anyways in September the EU Commision will officiay come out with a statement and all those speculations will go in history.
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drugata rabota e deka bugarite nema nikogash da go zatvorat "centarot" vo Bitola ako uspeat da go otvorat. se` e toa isplanirana rezhija od bugarska strana. mnogu e jasno deka ne im se isplati otvaranje na novi "centri" i voveduvanje na dopolnitelna birokratija koga na granica ke nudat isti "uslugi". treba da sum smotan ako potrosham povekje od 500m pat za da sredam prethodno rabota vo centarot na BG-DS koga na granica i onaka ke chmaam i kisnam...ili mozhno e voveduvanje na sistematsko "maltretiranje i dremenje" za onie shto nemaat livche za da si go opravdaat bugarite postoenjeto na noviot propaganden centar. mislam deka navistina ke se raboti za nekakvo dodatno livche ili kartonche shto ke go davaat (kako kaj onie shto vleguvaat so avtomobil vo BG) bidejki ako lepat viza vo pasosh tie ke gi ispolepat 30-te strani za mnogu kratok period. |
There is no such thing as a free visa. Somebody always pays. The visas for Serbian and Macedonian citizens will be free of charge for them. But they will be payed by the Bulgarian taxpayers. And it is really a sign of good will by the BG state.
Bulgaria can NOT issue visas at the border (exceptions are allowed under some urgent situations) as this is not allowed by the EU/Schengen directives/laws. Bulgaria will open consulates in Bitola, MK, and Nish, Serbia, to ease up the procedures.
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shto bi znachelo toa? ako lepat vizi, pasoshite bi bile za brzo vreme popolneti i nevazhechki so shto lugjeto ,koi chesto patuvaat ili moraat da patuvaat za BG, bi bile izlozheni na dodatni troshoci za nova patna isprava.osobeno lugjeto vo pogranichnite regioni ,shto chesto odat i trguvaat, bi bile primorani ili da se maltretiraat po MK-sluzbi za novi dokumenti koi ke bidat mnogu poskapi (poradi noviot standart...mislam nakaj 50evra se zbori) ili zimanje na bugarski pasosh shto mnogukratno ke ja olesni,poeftini i ubrza celata pogranichna procedura na MK-patnici. sepak,mislam deka bugarite ke vovedat "viza-kartonche" ispolneto so penkalce bidejki se skrzhavi i drebnichavi po surat i sigurno nema da troshat povekje od krajno potrebniot minimum. |
Bulgarian visas will be issued for longer periods of time - from 6 months to up to an year. So a frequent travellor will not have to get a new visa too often.
It is also possible that Bulgaria will recognized the Schengen visas. SO if you already have a valid visa from, ex. Germany, you don't need to apply for a Bulgarian one for a short stay of up to 10 days.
Во 2050 Бугарија ќе има 5,5 мил. жители?
Од 1990 до 2004 година, бројот на бугарското население е намален за 1,2 милиони жители, па Бугарија сега има 7,76 милиони. Доколку продолжи ваквиот тренд во 2020 година државата ќе има седум милиони, но, тука не е крајот на амбисот!
Алармот оддамна е вклучен, но за жал се чини дека ништо не може да ја спречи забрзаната демографска катастрофа што и се заканува на Бугарија. Статистиките се поразителни. Од 1990 до 2004 година, бројот на бугарското население е намален за 1,2 милиони жители, па Бугарија сега има 7,76 милиони. Но, тука не е крајот на амбисот! Доколку продолжи ваквиот тренд во 2020 година државата ќе има седум милиони, а во 2050 само 5,5 милиони "преостанати" Бугари. Демографските стручњаци тврдат дека една од главните причини за падот на наталитетот, е заминувањето во странство на стотици илјади млади Бугари. Токму онаа највиталната категорија на граѓани во демографска и производствено-технолошка смисла на зборот. Многу се очекува од новиот закон кој стапува на сила од први јануари идната година, а кој предвидува редица стимулации за создавање нови генерации. Породилното боледување се зогелемува од сегашните 135 на 315 денови, а родилката ќе зима од социјално дури 90 отсто од редовната плата. Државата ќе ги преземе трошоците за чување на детето во домашни услови се до наполнета втора година. Целиот проект, кој предвидува и други мерки, ќе чини 15,8 милиони евра.
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| Originally posted by asterix |
so viza tip C+D se imaat pogolemi "prava" i mozhnosti nego vashiot pocheten kvazi priem vo 2007(ako imate srekja).so takva viza mozhe da se raboti vo EU(postojan prestoj bez nikakvo ogranichuvanje,rabota,shkolo...) + da se patuva vo shengen zona bez potreba od druga viza so maksimalen prestoj do 90 dena vo nea...od kaj gi iskopa tie 10 dena zhiti se`??
a vie kakvi vizi ke voveduvate,nacionalni ili shengen ?
a znaesh li deka vi baraat od evropa da gi otvorite dosiejata od tajnite sluzhbi? pa razmisli malku...
sigurno vo vashiot pechat ne se zbori za toa bidejki site vashi politichari se bivshi komunistichki agenti.
(drugite gluposti ne ti go komentiram...)
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Originally posted by toni_a
so viza tip C+D se imaat pogolemi "prava" i mozhnosti nego vashiot pocheten kvazi priem vo 2007(ako imate srekja).so takva viza mozhe da se raboti vo EU(postojan prestoj bez nikakvo ogranichuvanje,rabota,shkolo...) + da se patuva vo shengen zona bez potreba od druga viza so maksimalen prestoj do 90 dena vo nea...od kaj gi iskopa tie 10 dena zhiti se`?? a vie kakvi vizi ke voveduvate,nacionalni ili shengen ? |
I don't know what a C+D visa is. Some kind of Schengen visa, I assume? Well, why is this relevant in this thread? You can even today get a visa to work and study in a EU state but you have to back it up with a work/education offer by a EU company/school.
Why is our accession "kvazi"? We have applyed in 1995 and gone trough all the procedured in the past 12 years. And we don't need "luck", as everything is based on certain work that the EU commission gives out to be fulfilled. I can garantee you that BG and RO will join the EU in 1 Jan. 2007. Will all of a sudden Bulgaria turn into a wealthy state? NO. Bulgaria will remain a poor country for years if not decades. But the same is true for most Eastern European countries. Being into the EU brings many benefits (and some negative aspects)but doesn't transfor the country overnight.
Bulgaria has signed an accession treaty with the EU, under which Bulgaria MUST join both the EURO currency zone and the SCHENGEN zone, once we fulfill the criteria. None of the 10 new members from 2004 is still in Schengen or has inrtoduced the EURO. In the next couple of years they will start introducing the EURO, first is Slovenia,etc. The 10 new members will join the Schegen in 2008.
In the case of Bulgaria, the EURO will be introduced in 2010 at the earliest. And we schould join the Schengen in 2009-2010. So this brings us to your question: "Will there be national or Schengen visas for entering Bulgaria?". They will be national visas. Whether they recognize the validity of Schegen visa upon entry in Bulgaria and for what period I can not tell; but usually it should be for a period of 10-15 days, and for longer stays you would need a BG visa.
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a znaesh li deka vi baraat od evropa da gi otvorite dosiejata od tajnite sluzhbi? pa razmisli malku... sigurno vo vashiot pechat ne se zbori za toa bidejki site vashi politichari se bivshi komunistichki agenti. |
Well, this is not exactly true. First, the EU recommends the opening of the files and this is not A MUST DO. However, there is currently a
law in Parliament to be voted in the nest month or so, that will declassify ALL the secret files from the National Security Communist records.
How many BG papers have you read in the past month that you know there is nothin about this there? There are numerous articles over this subject. Why would not the media comment on this issue? It something that sells papers...
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(drugite gluposti ne ti go komentiram...) |
What other bullsh*t have I said?Please be more specific so can answer.
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| Originally posted by nukleus Abe Bugarite ke dadat i "g`s" samo da im ostane narod vo drzavata kolku da funkcionira kako drzava, eve zoshto delat pasoshi kako nezdravi: Во 2050 Бугарија ќе има 5,5 мил. жители? Од 1990 до 2004 година, бројот на бугарското население е намален за 1,2 милиони жители, па Бугарија сега има 7,76 милиони. Доколку продолжи ваквиот тренд во 2020 година државата ќе има седум милиони, но, тука не е крајот на амбисот!.... |
Sarcasm is out of place for a person from a country with similar issues like Macedonia. In Macedonia as well, the majority, Macedonians, have fewer kids while the minorities, Albanian and Roma, have more. At the same time, educated ppl look for work in the West as they get more money. This is a serious issue in all Eastern European countiries. The fact that Bulgaria has acknowedgled the problem is important. Dismissing this problem would only worsen the impact.
Furthermore, this statistic is only prediction in the next 50 years. Lots of things can change in the next half a century.
po se` izgleda ,bidejki na rumunija i se kritikuvani 4 ,a na bg 6 raboti shto treba da gi popravi, ke imate ogranichuvanja kako na primer nemanje dostap do fondovi i sredstva se dodeka ne se ispolnat site raboti shto treba vsushnost pred vlez da bidat ispolneti.
eden DE-politichar se izjasni vo stilot: "shit happens" ,ama sega nemozhelo vekje da se popravi greshkata koja vekje e napravena so davanje konkretna data pred voopshto da se ispolni potrebnoto.
na BG zashto i beshe ukinat vizniot rezhim ,te. olesnat ? zashto srabotija bugarite ili zatoa shto pretea so nekoi raboti ??
seushte ne e konkreten uslov toa so dosiejata ama ke stane naskoro,vo sekoj sluchaj e baranje.dali sega ili kako uslov posle "vlez" vo EU ,se razbira povrzano so spomnatite handicap-ovi koj ke bidat nalozheni.za javnite ubistva i mafijashkite strukturi nema potreba da se zbori...seto toa si e povrzano preku komunistichkite shpionski strukturi od vremeto i sega. EU toa saka da go rasvetli i ukine...
gledajte sega vo septemvri shto i kako ,bidejki ke treba da se ubrza procenkata na komisijata koja trebashe vo oktomvri da bide...za da mozhat germancite da ratifikuvaat.ima ushte pola drzhavi shto treba da potpishat za da "vlezete".
viza za work dobivate "malo-morgen" vo momentalnava sostojba,osven onie shto zavrshile tuka fakultet ,ama lugjeto nemaat pravo za vreme na periodot dodeka baraat istovremeno da rabotat i toj period e ogranichen na maksimalno 1 god.
shengen vizite se so ogranichen rok i vazhat do 90 dena vo pola godina.vie vsushnost dobivte besplatni C-vizi od EU.samo turistichki prava i ste trgnati od "blacklist"...
ostanuva prashanje zashto voveduvate vizi za sosedna zemja koga na primer germancite ne vovedoa za hrvatite duri i za vreme na vojnata??
a za besplatnite vizi...ima i za Cheshka(koi se svetlosni godini pred vas),pa taka netreba da se lazhete sebesi i nas deka neshto pravite za Makedonija...
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| Originally posted by toni_a kvazi - zatoa shto imate preoden period i nemate direktno polni prava kako starite chlenki.zatoa i ne vleguvate direktno vo shengen-ot i treba prvin da se dokazhete. po se` izgleda ,bidejki na rumunija i se kritikuvani 4 ,a na bg 6 raboti shto treba da gi popravi, ke imate ogranichuvanja kako na primer nemanje dostap do fondovi i sredstva se dodeka ne se ispolnat site raboti shto treba vsushnost pred vlez da bidat ispolneti. eden DE-politichar se izjasni vo stilot: "shit happens" ,ama sega nemozhelo vekje da se popravi greshkata koja vekje e napravena so davanje konkretna data pred voopshto da se ispolni potrebnoto. |
Bulgaria will have the same rights as the new members from 2010. Any new member needs to go through all the procedures to enter Schengen. The EU needs to update their computer system and so on. SO Why is this “kvazi”? Bulgarians LIKE ALL NEW MEMBERS will not have free access to some state’s labor markets for up to 8 years. Still we will have to other markets – Sweden, Finland, Spain, and the 10 new members….maybe UK, Ireland and Greece. THIS IS TRUE FOR ALL NEW MEMBERS.
I am aware of the “red zones” in EU commissions report on Bulgaria in May. According to Bulgaria’s EU integration minister 82% of the problems indicated in the May report have been addressed and the other 18% will be by September 8th, the last day we can report progress to the EU. Then b/n September 8th and 20th the EU commission will send commissars to Bulgaria to investigate the progress done and report at the end of September. The Final report for BG and RO will be in September, not October.
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na BG zashto i beshe ukinat vizniot rezhim ,te. olesnat ? zashto srabotija bugarite ili zatoa shto pretea so nekoi raboti ?? |
Well, it was “ukinat” not ”olesnat”. And we fulfilled the conditions set by the EU. That’s all; there is no world conspiracy against Macedonia.
When I went to Munich this summer I got on the plane and got off in Munich. When I was getting through the customs desk the guy only saw my passport and asked me for a reason for my trip, I told him…he put a stamp and that was all, no visa. Took me 2 minutes. I call this “ukinat” regime.
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Gledajte sega vo septemvri shto i kako ,bidejki ke treba da se ubrza procenkata na komisijata koja trebashe vo oktomvri da bide...za da mozhat germancite da ratifikuvaat.ima ushte pola drzhavi shto treba da potpishat za da "vlezete". |
Well, true…it will be in September. Out of 27 countries only 2 states have not at least partially ratified the treaty, Germany and Denmark. However, we know the dates when they will ratify it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Accession_2005
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ostanuva prashanje zashto voveduvate vizi za sosedna zemja koga na primer germancite ne vovedoa za hrvatite duri i za vreme na vojnata?? |
Croats are in the white list of Schegen my friend. Germany has NO own visa policy. All EU members that are in the Schenge or are pending members (10 new members + BG and RO) must have THE SAME visa regime. SO if the Macedonians need visa from the Schengen, we can not do anything about it. It’s in our Treaty of Accession.
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| Originally posted by toni_a Израел, Полска, Естонија, Латвија, Чешка и Словачка издаваат бесплатни визи за македонските граѓани. |
Bulgaria is a neighboring country mate; it's natural there will be much more border crossing.
Again those countries' taxpayers pay for your visas. However, don't tell me that more people will go visit Estonia or Latvia for some reason than Bulgaria. Last year more that 200 000 citizens have been to Bulgaria for some reason. This is in times more than the Macedonians that have been to Estonia.
Iako dosega vazeshe "devizata" deka napadot e najdobra odbrana denes za toj napad protiv Makedonija EU ke bara argumenti koj treba da gi dostavat Karakacanov i Parvanov za izjavite koj ne bea voopshto argumentirani i pridonesoa za da gi "zasmrdat" Makedonsko-Bugarskite odnosi.
Eve kako Albancite ke se integriraat vo Unijata,primer shto treba da go sledat i Bugarite i Grcite a veruvam i Srbite dokolku sakaat bez zamerki da gi koristat site sredstva na EU:
-Во рамките на напорите за асоцијација со Европската Унија, албанската влада ќе почне да ја подобрува состојбата во делот од Мала Преспа населен со Македонци и да им ги гарантира националните права, јави албанскиот весник „Коха јоне“.
Владата и локалните претставници на Мала Преспа, односно албанската општина Лиќенес, постигнале договор за подобрување на патиштата и за заштита на националниот, историскиот и културниот идентитет во овој сиромашен крај.
- Работата веќе почна со поставување два двојазични знаци, на македонски и на албански јазик, на патиштата што водат до деветте села во нашата општина. Ќе бидат сменети и имињата на овие села, за да се вратат старите македонски имиња на местото на албанизираните имиња воведени пред 1990 година - изјавил за „Коха јоне“ градоначалникот на Лиќенес Панди Андони.
Весникот пишува дека договорот за стабилизација и асоцијација што Албанија го потпиша со Европската Унија ја обврзува земјата да ги гарантира малцинските права, како што е отворање училишта на јазик на малцинствата и поставување двојазични патни знаци и особено попис на малцинствата.
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| Originally posted by nukleus Ako Albancite moraat da gi priznaat Makedoncite na svoja teritorija togash i Bugarite ke moraat da go storat istoto dokolku sakaat celosno da se integriraat vo EU.Bugarija pokraj kriminalot za vlez vo unijata ima zadaca da gi reshi malcinskite prashanja otkako veke dva pati javno e opomenata od unijata vo odnos na nacional-shovinistickata politika shto ja sproveduva protiv Makedoncite. Iako dosega vazeshe "devizata" deka napadot e najdobra odbrana denes za toj napad protiv Makedonija EU ke bara argumenti koj treba da gi dostavat Karakacanov i Parvanov za izjavite koj ne bea voopshto argumentirani i pridonesoa za da gi "zasmrdat" Makedonsko-Bugarskite odnosi. Eve kako Albancite ke se integriraat vo Unijata,primer shto treba da go sledat i Bugarite i Grcite a veruvam i Srbite dokolku sakaat bez zamerki da gi koristat site sredstva na EU: -Во рамките на напорите за асоцијација со Европската Унија, албанската влада ќе почне да ја подобрува состојбата во делот од Мала Преспа населен со Македонци и да им ги гарантира националните права, јави албанскиот весник „Коха јоне“. Владата и локалните претставници на Мала Преспа, односно албанската општина Лиќенес, постигнале договор за подобрување на патиштата и за заштита на националниот, историскиот и културниот идентитет во овој сиромашен крај. - Работата веќе почна со поставување два двојазични знаци, на македонски и на албански јазик, на патиштата што водат до деветте села во нашата општина. Ќе бидат сменети и имињата на овие села, за да се вратат старите македонски имиња на местото на албанизираните имиња воведени пред 1990 година - изјавил за „Коха јоне“ градоначалникот на Лиќенес Панди Андони. Весникот пишува дека договорот за стабилизација и асоцијација што Албанија го потпиша со Европската Унија ја обврзува земјата да ги гарантира малцинските права, како што е отворање училишта на јазик на малцинствата и поставување двојазични патни знаци и особено попис на малцинствата. |
Dude! read the title of the thread: Bulgaria set to introduce free visas.
-Полска реши од 1-ви август годинава, македонските државјани да ги ослободи од обврската за поседување на транзитни визи, доколку имаат важечка виза или одобрение за престој издадени од една од 26 европски држави.
Амбасада на Република Полска во Скопје соопшти дека „транзитот преку територијата на Полска не може да биде еднократно подолг од пет дена и мора да биде сместен во периодот на важноста на соодветна виза или одобрение за престој“.
Олеснувањата важат доколку се поседува виза или одобрение за престој издадено од: Австрија, Белгија, Кипар, Чешка, Данска, Естонија, Финска, Франција, Грција, Шпанија, Холандија, Исланд, Литванија, Луксембург, Летонија, Малта, Германија, Норвешка, Португалија, Словачка, Словенија, Шведска, Унгарија, Италија, Швајцарија и Лихтенштајн.
Олеснувањата се согласно одлуките на Европскиот парламент и Советот кои воведуваат поедноставен систем на контрола на лица на надворешните граници при транзитни поминувања.
-Македонските граѓани за влез во Албанија повеќе нема да плаќаат влезна виза. Одлука за тоа донесла Владата во Тирана, која на ваков чекор, според весникот „Шекули“, се одлучила поради големиот интерес на македонските граѓани за користење на годишните одмори во Албанија.
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| Originally posted by asterix There will be no visas for Bulgarians that go to Serbia or Macedonia dude. |
This has not been decided yet. So , you have no info on this matter. Your ambasador just stated that he HOPES Macedonia will not intruduce visas on a basis of reciprocity. Even if no visas are enacted for Bulgarian citizens immediatly, their introduction is not ruled out at all.
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Originally posted by Satanico Pandemonium
This has not been decided yet. So , you have no info on this matter. Your ambasador just stated that he HOPES Macedonia will not intruduce visas on a basis of reciprocity. Even if no visas are enacted for Bulgarian citizens immediatly, their introduction is not ruled out at all. |
Well, you are absolutely right that there is no firm decision from Skopje at this point, but we all know there will be no visas. It is simply not in Macedonian interest to do so.
It is not like we have choice here to put or not visas for Macedonians. It is simply a requirement by the EU. Unlike Romania, we are waiting till the very last day 31 Dec. 2006 to do so. And this visas are gonna be free and with minimal application procedures.
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| Originally posted by asterix Well, you are absolutely right that there is no firm decision from Skopje at this point, but we all know there will be no visas. It is simply not in Macedonian interest to do so. It is not like we have choice here to put or not visas for Macedonians. It is simply a requirement by the EU. Unlike Romania, we are waiting till the very last day 31 Dec. 2006 to do so. And this visas are gonna be free and with minimal application procedures. |
Hm, ne znam da li ne e ili e vo Makedonski interes da se uvedat vizi. Koga Romanija uvede vizi za Srbija, Srbija vednas po reciprocitet uvede vizi za Romanija. Najgolemite bunenja dojdoa od Romanija zatoa sto neproporcionalno poveke Romanci ja posetuvaa Srbija odkolku Srbi Romanija. Pokazuvaa sliki pred Srpskata ambasada vo Buk*rest, Romanci nokevaat za viza posto nekolku dena se cekase za istata. Voopsto ne e iskluceno Makedonija istoto da go stori. Vo Makedonija se poveke sozreva nepravdata napravena so vizite i prasanje e na vreme koga nekoj ke kaze dosta e, vizi za EU posto nema sto veke da se izgubi. Ne za dzabe postoi princip na reciprocitet. A da li za Bugarija ke ima vizi ili ne, toa zavisi isto taka od nasite megjusebni odnosi. Nekoj raboti javno ne se kazuvaat, no , izjavite na Kalfin se zemeni vo predvid. Diplomatski ke se kaze , nie ne sakame vizi so Bugarija, no zaradi princip na reciprocitet mora da gi uvedeme. Se e mozno, zavisi od strategijata na nasata vlada.
Serbia has unofficially agreed along time ago as Bulgaria was correct to them - postponed the visa regime as long as possible, unlike Romania; will issue free visas; gave Serbia a 1 year notice of the future change in the visa regime; Serbia also knows it is not Bulgaria's choice.
The free visas for Macedonian citizens are based on the assumption that there will be no visa regime for BG citizens. I think that if Skopje starts "paying big" and does not agree to that, Bulgaria will take up the EU recommendation of 35euro for a visa.
For Bulgaria, however, getting visafree travel for Serbia is very important as the shortest highway to Western Europe goes through Serbian territory.
As for Macedonia, honestly, I don't think a visa requirement for entering MK would have a major impact on Bulgaria. All that it would cause is that fewer Bulgarians would choose to visit Ohrid, as this is basically where all BG tourist to MK go.
Anyways, let's wait and see what happens.
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| Originally posted by asterix Trust me, there will be no visas for Bulgarians in Serbia or Macedonia. Serbia has unofficially agreed along time ago as Bulgaria was correct to them - postponed the visa regime as long as possible, unlike Romania; will issue free visas; gave Serbia a 1 year notice of the future change in the visa regime; Serbia also knows it is not Bulgaria's choice. The free visas for Macedonian citizens are based on the assumption that there will be no visa regime for BG citizens. I think that if Skopje starts "paying big" and does not agree to that, Bulgaria will take up the EU recommendation of 35euro for a visa. For Bulgaria, however, getting visafree travel for Serbia is very important as the shortest highway to Western Europe goes through Serbian territory. As for Macedonia, honestly, I don't think a visa requirement for entering MK would have a major impact on Bulgaria. All that it would cause is that fewer Bulgarians would choose to visit Ohrid, as this is basically where all BG tourist to MK go. Anyways, let's wait and see what happens. |
Comparison for 2004: 229 902 Bulgarians visited Macedonia, 655 974 Macedonians visited Bulgaria (after bulgarian Ministry of economy and energetics). The situation in 2005 was the same.
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| Originally posted by asterix ... |
Decision on Bulgaria’s and Romania’s entry
Final monitoring reports for Bulgaria and Romania are due on 26 September 2006. This marks a crucial moment for the two accession countries, as the last reports will decide, whether accession will take place as scheduled on 1 January 2007 or 1 January 2008.
The last monitoring reports of 16 May 2006 confirmed the ongoing progress towards fulfilling of the Copenhagen criteria. At the same time, there are still some policy areas that give rise to concern for the Commission. The EU could make use of a “safeguard clause” which allows postponing Bulgaria’s and Romania’s accession by a year to 2008 if the EU sees “serious risk” of the country being unable to implement the required reforms.
nikoj ne vika deka nema da vlezete.se raboti dali ke bide `07 ili `08. neznam shto e toa tolku problem za vas??
evropskite drzhavi chekaat PROCENKA i PREDLOG od komisijata (Baroso).znachi komisijata (koja maj) odlozhi ,sega treba da kazhe.sigurno ,toa jas ti go garantiram, e deka ako vlezete `07 toa ke bide povrzano so ispolnuvanje na uslovi...
e taa komisija imashe data za do pochetokot na oktomvri a toa e kasno za na primer Germanija da mozhe da ratifikuva vo Bundestag i Bundesrat... kapish??
zatoa treba se` da se sredi vo septemvri ili ke si chekate edna godina
datata dogovorena (prethodno pishav za komentarot na germanecot) e ili `07 ili `08. da kazhea od komisijata porano vie ke slavevte priem.
vaka ushte ne ste slavele poshto ne ste primeni.koga ke vidish petardi,raketi i slavenje togash ke znaesh deka ste vlegle vo EU.prethodno ne.
Романија и Бугарија треба да станат членки на 1 јануари 2007 ако ги исполнат условите за членство и ако Договорот за пристапување на Република Бугарија и Романија биде ратификуван од парламентите на државите членки. Договорот беше потпишан од претставниците на државите членки на ЕУ во Абе де Нојминстер во Луксембург на 25 април 2005.
pamti go "ako-to" ,ke vi treba za ponataka...
ke ti dadam primeri za iskluchoci kako mozhnosta za bilateralni dogovori kade shto na primer avstralijanci ili izraelci ili amerikanci itn... mozhat otkako vlezat vo DE kako turisti bez problem i vednash potoa da "prenamenat" turistichki-prestoj vo prestoj za rabota ,vo samata drzhava (DE) bez da se vrakjaat i se zanimavaat preku ambasadi-germanski vo nivnite drzhavi ili nadvor od shengen-zona...ili deka amerikancite ne gi pochituvaat novite EU-chlenki i im baraat vizi za vlez vo USA...
inaku za francija ne e potrebna viza ako doagja turist-drzhavjanin na falklandski ostrovi ili na ekvador ,dodeka za germanija e potrebna viza na istite.
ili site zemji za koi po princip ima potreba od viza ako poseduvaat viza za prestoj od gibraltar nemaat potreba od viza za francija.znachi Makedonec so viza za prestoj od gibraltar mozhe bez problem da vleze vo shengen zonata odnosno francija...
...znachi e mozhno da se napravi neshto!!
aj sega bez "akanje" kazhi zashto voveduvate vizi za MK !!
Sto be sega da resavame Gibaltarski krstoslovki, koga nikoj ne moze da objasni zosto e nevozmozno za normalen Makedonec...(ako nema kece i ne e svercer na opijati i beli butkici),a koj si ima i biznis i imot vo MKD, prosto i lesno da dobie korektna viza i so korektno plateno patno osiguruvanje....da prestojuva... eve ...10 dena vo edna Slovenija (rasprasaj se za procedurata ...), ako ne so edinstveniot mozen odgovor : GENOCID NA SE MAKEDONSKO!!!
Bugarire se samo cresnata na slagot na tortata....batali gi.....
Again I am telling you this as someone whose profession is connected with the EU integration and I have the best possible information on the subject. If I had a million dollars today I would not think twice but bet them that Bulgaria will join the EU in 4 months.
As for Germany’s ratification of the Treaty of Accession it will take place as following:
Bundestag: 26 October 2006
Bundesrat: 24 November 2006
This is according to the German government. Germany will be the last EU member to ratify the treaty.
I am not gonna comment further on your “ako” as it is pointless. Just wait and see on 26th September.
Back to the topic now. The visas.
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Originally posted by toni_a
ke ti dadam primeri za iskluchoci kako mozhnosta za bilateralni dogovori kade shto na primer avstralijanci ili izraelci ili amerikanci itn... mozhat otkako vlezat vo DE kako turisti bez problem i vednash potoa da "prenamenat" turistichki-prestoj vo prestoj za rabota ,vo samata drzhava (DE) bez da se vrakjaat i se zanimavaat preku ambasadi-germanski vo nivnite drzhavi ili nadvor od shengen-zona...ili deka amerikancite ne gi pochituvaat novite EU-chlenki i im baraat vizi za vlez vo USA... |
What the hell? Neither of those countries –US, Australia, Israel - is in the black list. Macedonia is. Understood? The 10 new members (-- Slovenia) need visas to go to the USA. However, US citizens don’t need visas for either of those. What is more the EU commission has many times expressed disappointment with this US policy and is pushing the US to change their policy. Currently the US has signed an agreement for visa-free travel with the 10 new members + Bulgaria and Romania, BUT this will go into action in 2009 (in the case of Bulgaria) at the earliest, only if the countries fulfill certain criteria stated in the roadmap agreements.
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inaku za francija ne e potrebna viza ako doagja turist-drzhavjanin na falklandski ostrovi ili na ekvador ,dodeka za germanija e potrebna viza na istite. ili site zemji za koi po princip ima potreba od viza ako poseduvaat viza za prestoj od gibraltar nemaat potreba od viza za francija.znachi Makedonec so viza za prestoj od gibraltar mozhe bez problem da vleze vo shengen zonata odnosno francija... ...znachi e mozhno da se napravi neshto!! |
Dude, whatever the arrangement are there THESE COUNTRIES ARE NOT IN THE BLACK LIST like MK. Here is the black list…do you see those states anywhere?!
Here is the Black list:
Afghanistan Albania Algeria Angola
Antigua and Barbuda Armenia Azerbaijan Bahrain
Bangladesh Barbados Belarus Belize
Benin Bhutan Bosnia and Herzegovina Botswana
Burkina Faso Burundi Cambodia Cameroon
Cape Verde Central African Republic Chad China
Colombia Comoros Congo C#244;te d'Ivoire
Cuba Democratic Republic of the Congo Djibouti Dominica
Dominican Republic East Timor Ecuador Egypt
Equatorial Guinea Eritrea Ethiopia Fiji
Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia Gabon Georgia Ghana
Grenada Guinea Guinea-Bissau Guyana
Haiti India Indonesia Iran
Iraq Jamaica Jordan Kazakhstan
Kenya Kiribati Kuwait Kyrgyzstan
Laos Lebanon Lesotho Liberia
Libya Madagascar Malawi Maldives
Mali Marshall Islands Mauritania Mauritius
Micronesia Moldova Mongolia Morocco
Mozambique Myanmar Namibia Nauru
Nepal Niger Nigeria North Korea
Northern Marianas Oman Pakistan Palau
Papua New Guinea Peru Philippines Qatar
Russia Rwanda Saint Kitts and Nevis Saint Lucia
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines Samoa S#227;o Tom#233; e Pr#237;ncipe Saudi Arabia
Senegal Serbia and Montenegro Seychelles Sierra Leone
Solomon Islands Somalia South Africa Sri Lanka
Sudan Suriname Swaziland Syria
Tajikistan Tanzania Thailand The Bahamas
The Gambia Togo Tonga Trinidad and Tobago
Tunisia Turkey Turkmenistan Tuvalu
Uganda Ukraine United Arab Emirates Uzbekistan
Vanuatu Vietnam Yemen Yugoslavia
Zambia Zimbabwe
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aj sega bez "akanje" kazhi zashto voveduvate vizi za MK !! |
Oh GOD! Are you retarded? I told you 200 times. You are in the Fvcking NEGATIVE SCHEGEN LIST. WE can not do anything about it.
toa shto sakam jas da kazham e deka sekogash (a za ova bi zalozhil 1mil. bez da mislam) postojat i se mozhni iskluchoci.
(taka i so vlezot na bg i ro koi ne ispolnuvaat uslovi bash onaka kako shto treba itn...)
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| Originally posted by asterix do you see those states anywhere?! |
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| Dominican Republic East Timor Ecuador Egypt |
ps
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As for Germany’s ratification of the Treaty of Accession it will take place as following: Bundestag: 26 October 2006 Bundesrat: 24 November 2006 This is according to the German government. Germany will be the last EU member to ratify the treaty. |
si ima hierarhija i rokovi...treba do kraj na god. da se sredi a zatoa e potrebna procenka na komisijata porano od oktomvri...
pps-ako komisijata dade pozitiven znak za, poveli povtorno tuka da ti(vi) go chestitam vlezot vo EU.
Pobitno e prasanjeto od Concrete, kako e mozno da mala zemja koja e vo ekonomska situacija i poarna od na primer Polska vo 1991 godina koga i gi ukinaa vizite, ili Romanija i Bugarija 2001 godina (romanija 2002 godina) a da se uste ima vizi? Ekonomijata voopsto ne e preduslov ovde za ukinuvanje na vizite.
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| Originally posted by asterix Nope. Being a Candidate and having a date means NOTHING. For example, Turkey has both "conditions" but Turks need visas, and will need, for many years to go. The decision for lifting the Schengen visa regime need to be taken by all Schengen members (EU + Norway and Island). UK and Ireland are not part of the Schengen so they will keep the visas even when the EU lifts them. Currently, it seems that lifting the visa restrictions for the Western Balkans will take place b/n mid 2008 to mid 2009. There will ease the visa application process for you next year. |
Yes and no regarding candidate countries and visa free travel. The difference between Macedonia and Turkey is that, EU in 2003 in Solun OFFICIALLY declared that Balkans future is within EU and this is EU strategy for the Balkans. No such promise has ever been made to Turkey. As a matter of fact, no promise that Turkey will ever become full EU member has ever been made. Negotiations can stop at any time. And they may even end in a privilegded partnership. The question is - if Balkan will one day be part of EU, in a few years time, with full rights to work and live across EU, than , the existance of visas today are somewhat in contradiction with this agenda? If EU should abolish visas with some countires, it is the candidate countries that soon will become part of itself. Again, when the decision for instance to make Eastern europe part of EU in the future was made, visas were abolished immediatly. 13 years before their actual membership! In a state of complete chaos and desperation in eastern europe. 3 years later, (since Solun meeting) , instead of visa liberalization as pointed out, we have visas faciliations. This was also clearly pointed by Austrian officials as an advise to Macedonian goverment where Macedonia has to ask for what was promised. Double standards do exist here.
Also, where did you hear that 2008 or 2009 is the year set for full liberalization of visa regime?
Toa e surovata vistina koja site obicni smrtnici gi boli zatoa shto samo do pred 15 godini istite Makedonci mozea da patuvaat slobodno niz Evropa a sega kako da stanaa bolni od Lepra pa moraat da igraat ora pred ambasadite i da dokazuvaat deka navistina imaat potreba za patuvanje shto predstavuva cin na gazenje vrz humanoto dostoinstvo na sekoj covek.
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| Originally posted by nukleus Pak ke povtoram deka prashanjeto so liberalizacija na vizniot rezim go dirigiraat nekolkumina oligarsi-mafijashi koj vo GETOTO gledaat neiscrpen izvor na rabotna raka za svoite robovladatelski firmi shto bi propadnale kus period posle "liberalizacijata".Za taa cel tie izdvojuvaat dosta golemi sumi so koi gi korumpiraat EU predstavnicite za da go zadrzat nepravedno nametnatiot vizen rezim pri shto EU predstavnicite kako Solana,Oli Ren,Barosso i drugi ke ni prodavaat "muda za bubrezi" so nekakvi "olesnuvanja" pri izmena na patnite ispravi i slicno kolku shto mozat podolgo za da gi cicaat parite koj za taa cel se deponiraat na nivnite smetki od strana na "belokapata mafija" i vlashko-makedonskata oligarhija. Toa e surovata vistina koja site obicni smrtnici gi boli zatoa shto samo do pred 15 godini istite Makedonci mozea da patuvaat slobodno niz Evropa a sega kako da stanaa bolni od Lepra pa moraat da igraat ora pred ambasadite i da dokazuvaat deka navistina imaat potreba za patuvanje shto predstavuva cin na gazenje vrz humanoto dostoinstvo na sekoj covek. |
A be sega, ima bar na ovoj topic 2 teorii
1. Tvojata deka vo interes na mafijata e ova. Kako ne im e vo interes vo Hrvatska i na drugi mesta togas?
2. Na Concrete , deka e vo prasanje genocid. Pak, i vo ovaa teorija ispagja deka genocidot e protiv Albanskiot, Bosanskiot, Srpskiot i Makedonskiot narod. A , ako utre, za godina dve se ukinat vizite ovaa teorija definitivno pagja vo voda. Spored ovaa teorija vizite bi stoele dodeka kompletno ne se sotrat site drzavi na Zapadniot Balkan.
I taa ne se iscrpuva samo so problemot na vizite: toa e samo eden segment na tretmanot posle situacijata :i sranja se slucuvaat....!!
Toa sranje i se sluci na Evropa i USA so raspadot na Yu , koga i se protna Makedonska drzava so Makedonski Drzavotvoren narod, problem koj bese arhiviran uste pred skoro 100 godini kako definitivno i "kulturno" zatvoren. Da bese kraj na 19 vek ke se resese problemot so metodite na toa vreme , ama 1992 bese veke dlaboko demokrastskata zora na 21 vek , taka da mora da se primenuvaat drugi iljaci.
Mnogumina se sekavaat na Gospodinot Badinter i negovata procenka , koja od drzavite na ex-Yu se po Evropski terk.....i neprijatnata situacija koga bespomosniot starec bese doveden , na kuso jaze da si gi izlize povrakanicite sred Skopje....verojatno i na onoj Roskop casovnikot vo rakata tretostepeniot britanski diplomat pred Sobranie....
Da ne dolzam mnogu iako simptomite :VIZNIOT REZIM se slicni ili isti , amnezata na bolesta ne e ista kaj site preostanati balkanski drzavi....taka da nema sporeduvanje so Albanija,Srbija itn.....
Mnogu pati sum spomnal deka idnata Evropa e Evropa na Regioni,so razviena lokalna samouprava, a ne na suvereni drzavi (normalno osven nekolkute poveke ednakvi megu ednakvite, barem vo prvite 100-150 godini...)
,a Makedonija e eden od Gospod daden REGION so pedigre koe se protega do zorata na drzavnata organiziranost na Zapadniot i sega narekuvaniot Slovenski svet i taa nikoj ne moze da ja izbrise.
Toa kamce na prepnuvanje sto na site involvirani na milion nacini i so razni interesi od razni pricini im preci e : Makedonskiot mnozinski narod vo taa Makedonija...nego treba da go snema: da stane ili ostane Bugarski,Grcki , Albanski,Srpski....Vlaski,Egupski,Ciganski....Patagonski.., no nikako ne smee da ima MAKEDONCI.....toa menuva i ke menuva mnogu raboti..vo ovoj komformisticki i sebicen svet....
Ako na toa se dodade trivijalniot problem na potreba od septicka jama vo koja Evropa ke go reexpatrira raznoraznoto gubre..( Kosovo e sepak pretesno )....slikata e potpolna...
Znaci za ocekuvanje e deka ovaa papazjanija ke potrae podolgo vreme, se dodeka postoi vo Makedonija respektabilna grupa koja sebe se narekuva Makedonci , koja se cuvstvuva taka i saka da si bide svoj na svoeto...i kamo sreka da zastapuvam glupava pogresna teorija...toa bi mi bilo najdrago....
"Also, where did you hear that 2008 or 2009 is the year set for full liberalization of visa regime?"
Set? I have never said it was set. As long as the Western Balkans states do their homework this period MID-2008 to MID-2009 is the most likely. I am sorry to tell you that, but you can not blame the EU for all yr problems with the visas. They have given you a list of requirement to fulfill BEFORE they can even consider lifting the regime. Currently BiH is the leader in the WBalkans in terms of doing the reforms for lifting the regime. Macedonia is second. Have you signed readmission treaties with all the countries the EU asked? I don't think so. Do you TODAY have modern/ secure Passports and Ids? NO. Even though these things will be done in the next 6 months or so, Bulgaria had all these done in 1999, as far as I remember. With all these things in a folder, the BG foreign minister Mihalova went to Brussels and demanded that visas are lifted as we have done everything they have required, plus we were about to start EU accession talks. One year later in 2000 the Big Brother decided to lift the visas as of 2001.
So if you are done with yr homework, let us say mid-2007, the commission could take a decision around mid-2008 that would take action in the next months to come. Ergo, b/n mid-2008 and mid-2009 is the most likely time period IF you do everything required.
Actually the EU is a very easy organization to predicts, esp. in term of future accession. I can give you an estimate period for Macedonia as well. It’s gonna be pretty exact.
These are just my prediction based on the current situation in the EU institutions, the Western Balkans and past accessions.
1.) Croatia will join the EU in 2010-2011.
2.) As for Macedonia, unfortunately, you will be placed in a package with Albania, BiH, Montenegro and Serbia. This package will not be firm and if, let us say, Albania goes really slowly they will drop AL out of the package and admit it later [the way Bulgaria and Romania were originally in the same package as the 2004 members, but were dropped for 2007]. The most optimistic admission date for Macedonia (and the rest WBalkans) is 2014.
3.) The only country I would not like to comment on is Turkey. The situation there is very hard to tell. Still, I’m certain the WBalkans will join the EU years before Turkey.
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| Originally posted by Satanico Pandemonium Da se nadevame deka Makedonija ke postapi vo sklad so megjunarodnite normi i ke uvede isto taka vizi po principot na reciprocitet. Vsusnost, krajno e vreme za cela EU istoto da se napravi. |
Makedonija ne moze da go napravi toa od prosta pricina sto ne e ekonomski sposobna toa da go napravi odma Bugarija ke digne problem u Brisel i ke dojde Solajna i ke ni kaze decki daj ne se glupirajte vie vizi na Bugarija glej ste kaj ste sto ste i na kogo ste uste vie vizi na nekogo ke uveduvate i nasive epa som taka taka.
Znaci i dvete teorii se vistini koj se i edinstveni odgovori na ona shto ni se slucuva vo periodot koga Evropa gi anulira megusebnite granici za koj ke povtoram po kojznae koj pat deka pred 15 godini za Makedoncite i ne bea granici pa imavme rabotnici na privremena rabota vo stranstvo.Denes nemame takvi rabotnici od Makedonija i toj shto ke uspee da izbega od GETOTO voopshto ne razmisluva pak da se vrati vo nego kako shto porano se vrakaa i investiraa Makedonskite rabotnici na privremena rabota vo stranstvo.Tuka prakticno se gleda teorijata na concrete za concretniot Makedonski problem,a se nadevam deka vo kratki crti uspeav da vi ja dolovam vistinskata slika i za mojata teorija koja denovive i prakticno ja gledame so rabotnicite vo textilnite i drugi robovladatelski firmi koj edinstveno rabotat vo Makedonija.