I ovaja zemja saka uceni ljude!

I ovaja zemja saka uceni ljude!
dejan	Site fakuteti vo avstralija ke pokacat HECS fees za 25%!!! omg! And this country wants more people to go to uni? If someone does a science degree for like 4 years, at the end it will cost them $30 000 to pay it off(around there) I'll be expecting a decline in uni admittents within the next few years. Bringing the HECS fees up to 25% is way too much. I don't know what i'll do when i want to go to Uni. I might have to work then pay the amount needed to start. This is not too good. Because not everyone has money ready in their bank accounts to give. Anyone agree with me?
Legal-Eagle	Thunder, very very very rarely does a reputable university grant exemptions for TAFE courses. Having said that it does acknowledge such courses such as nursing and a few select others, but it only grants you exceptions for a few modules not for the entire subject. If you are doing an OPEN FOUNDATION course (which is a prelude to a university degree) will they grant you an exemption, but not a straight-out degree. Trust me, i am a girl i know these things. As far as your calculations are concerned about the time spent obtaining your qualifications, you reap what you sow. Nothing worthwhile is achieved without blood sweat and tears!
cat	$100000 dolari plata? E ama slatko se iznasmeav. Ako sakas imaj zavrseno i tri fakulteti i doktorska disertacija ama tie pari nema da gi zemas ni posle edna ni posle tri ili posle deset godini. Zosto tresete od rakav a ne od realnosta? Statistikata pokazuva deka vo Avstralija fakultetski obrazovanite zarabotuvaat vo prosek megju 40000 do 80000 dolari. Povekje zarabotuvaat onie sto imaat svoj uspesen biznis ili se investitori. Slusam deka tuka nekoja dama bila CEO. Bravo, ako damata navistina e toa togas takvite se isklucok i zarabotuvaat daleku povekje od $100000, no kako sto rekov pogore prosekot e daleku ispod $100000. Zavrseniot fakultet moze da ti osigura na primer start od $40K do $50K no ako sakas da zarabotis povekje od toa i ako rabotis za drug togas ke treba da rabotis kako konj i na osnova na postignatite rezultati sekoja godina da baras pokacuvanje, vo sprotivno cel zivot mozes da si ostanes na relativno niska plata. Za ogromniot broj Avstralijanci $100000 e suste samo son, ne znam vie na koj svet ziveete.
Legal-Eagle	Cat, at times like this they always come out of the woodwork. Someone has called for reinforcements but to me it is neither here nor there. Let me give you a fact that I found quiet impossible to fathom until i was personally offered a position in Flemington. A simple (used loosely) Produce Merchant for example Coles or Woolworths is currently on $200,000.00 plus per annum. If you find that hard to believe i think you should step outside the bubble that you live in. There are people here in Australia who are proprietors who are earning inexcess of that kind of money so why are you having trouble believing it? You are only as good as yourself!!!! "Money talks and bullshit walks" a phrase my father taught me a long long time ago and is still evident in today's economic enviroment. Unfortunately the only thing wrong with Australia is that there is a tall poppy syndrome, but that is part and parcel of our "make-up" Open the Sydney Morning Herald on any given Wednesday or Saturday and just peruse the Positions Vacant and you will quickly realise that a salary package of $100,000.00 plus is not an illusion but a reality, maybe it is time you asked your employer for a wage rise. Just remember, my previous comments "You are only as good as yourself" and "Money talks bullshit walks" Cheers
Thunder from down under	pa neli HECS se plajka otkako ke najdis rabota , ti zapiraat od platata? so ne odis na TAFE prvo pa posle na uni i ke dobies 2 godini off ili godina i pol za 2 godini na Tafe zavisit na koj uni ,TAFE e $75 -$500 per godisno namesto da plajkajs $20,000 godinata na uni
dejan	Da plakjas za HECS koga ke imas rabota posle Uni. Imas pravo za TAFE. Nekoja zena i kazela na majkami deka nekoj stu ke odi na tafe, i sto ke ima nekoja rabotno iskustvo vo mcdonalds ke ima po dobri sanci da najdat dobro rabota posle. Zasto? Deka rabotele vo mcdonalds, dobili nekoj experience. Sepak fakutet e dobro za mene. Kako jas sto znam manegerot za Alfa koli vo Queensland e Makedonec. Odil na fakutet i nesto drugo i sega stanal maneger.
Thunder from down under	dejan vo tafe ke gi ucis istite predmeti so ke gi ucis vo uni,za 2 godini vo tafe ako odis posle nemora 4 godini na uni nego 2 i pol ili 2 zavisit koj uni, me razbra sega? ako sakas ti rabota vo mcdonalds mozam jas da ti najdam ,poznavam toj so e assistant manager vo mc donnalds vo city vo brizbane ,barale sega rabotnici za lupenje kompiri
dejan	Jas ne bi sakal da odam na tafe. Po dobro da odis na fakutet, toa e moje mislenje. Ne bre, ne sakam vo mcdonalds jas. A da lupam kompiri....ke razmislam, i pomagam na majkami po nekoj pati so lupenje kompiri:p
Legal-Eagle	Dejan for someone that didnt like anything about Australia and wanted to go back to Macedonia you suprise me with your intent to attend university. You are so fickle. Contrary to your belief NOT everything in Australia is for free. You have to work hard to achieve those things you truly desire. I dont see why you shouldnt pay HECS, everyone else does. There are some of us who were fortunate enough to pay our university fees upfrontand not incur HECS. HECS is repayable after you have secured a job when you have graduated YES believe it or NOT, you have to pay your dues to the county. University also affords you greater opportunities than TAFE. I dont want to appear as a snob, but most people would rather a university graduate to one from TAFE. Is working at McDonalds beneath you? How else are you going to fund your airfare back to Macedonia? or have the lights suddenly come on and you are going to reap the benefits of a country that many Australians have sown?
Legal-Eagle	quote: Originally posted by dejan omg! And this country wants more people to go to uni? If someone does a science degree for like 4 years, at the end it will cost them $30 000 to pay it off(around there) OMG?! more like WTF?! you are bitching over $30,000 over 4 years? that is less than $10,000 a year, a small price to pay for someone who will be earning inexcess of $100,000 p.a! People like you dejan never cease to amaze me. [:(!]
Thunder from down under	quote: Originally posted by Legal-Eagle University also affords you greater opportunities than TAFE. I dont want to appear as a snob, but most people would rather a university graduate to one from TAFE. he will graduate at uni but insead goind 4 years he only has to go 2 years if he does 2 years in TAFE, nisto ne razbirate be
dejan	Yes leagle eagle i would like to attend university. You should also know that it isn't good to make assumptions about people over the internet. You are being rude to me in a discreet way, so please, stop having hissy fits, or i'll say something that i won't regret. ok? Really? Not everything is free in this country? wow amazing. Yes working at mcdonalds is beneath me. Why work at a place where i have to work after school, then i come home and don't have time for my study's. Well no thanks. I know that i can't find a perfect job, but at least something that also gives me the opportunity to study. Yes i am bitching over $30 000. Earning more than $100 000, you think that will happen automatically after you finish Uni? Sorry but no, it does take time to get up the ladder. There you go again, making assumptions about people over the internet. "People like you dejan never cease to amaze me." Now you know me very well. Stop hassling me. And to add something else, i have friends who were born in Australia and they say that they dislike the country. Do i have a fit like you do? No. But anyway, why would i? Not like i'm deeply hurt or anything. Thunder ona e vo pravo, nekoj maneger bi sakal da ima nekoj graduate degree mesto tafe. Povise znaene.
Thunder from down under	quote: Originally posted by dejan Thunder ona e vo pravo, nekoj maneger bi sakal da ima nekoj graduate degree mesto tafe. Povise znaene. zini zemjo indijo i lapnigi ovie dvajca nad mene so imaat postirano YOU DONT STOP AT TAFE ,YOU KEEP GOING HOW HARD CAN ONE SENTANCE BE TO UNDERSTAND
dejan	lele bre covek:p smri se;) Well i'm not so sure about tafe, i haven't talked to anyone that has been to tafe, well not engaged in a conversation about it.
Legal-Eagle	Dejan i made an informed post based on your fickleness on the forum. You either like being here or you dont. It is a case of you want to have your cake and nibble/feast on everyone else's. REALITY CHECK - it doesnt work like that at your age, not even at mine, but one day you will enjoy the fruits of your labour and if you are clever enough the fruits of other's labour. Stop your whinging. I am not hassling you, if i was you would know it! YOU LITTLE SNOB! How dare you say that working at McDonalds is beneath you and that interferes with your study... what it does do is teach you good time management skills and also gives you the opportunity to interact in a working enviroment. I am the managing director and CEO of several diverse companies and I NEVER EVER act all high and mighty, nor would i ever ask my staff to do anything that i would not do myself.Therefore i dont believe that any job is beneath me, i even am elected for staffroom duties (and I own the bloody company!!) I studied at university and worked with a law firm similtaneously and i believe that it taught me a lot more than just burying my head in my law books! Maybe you dont earn your first $100,000 in your first year, but by the 3rd year you are well on your way 'assuming' you hold the correct qualifications relevant to your chosen vocation. Thunder i am sorry but i disagree with you, inorder to obtain that 'ideal job' or thereabouts, university graduates are much more desirable than TAFE graduates, and there are certain courses you can not do at TAFE
Thunder from down under	quote: Originally posted by Legal-Eagle Thunder i am sorry but i disagree with you, inorder to obtain that 'ideal job' or thereabouts, university graduates are much more desirable than TAFE graduates, and there are certain courses you can not do at TAFE za stap placite dvajcata uste ednas ke vi kazham i ako ne razberite nesto ne e vo red so dvajcata zimi majka, ok vaka - its year 2005 lets say to finish university you will need 4 years,ok which will be 2009 now from 2005 to 2007 you go to TAFE you graduate ,right? in 2007 you sign up at uni,and you get examptions 1 1/2 to 2 years depands which university and what do you study from 2007 to 2009 you are at the university and you will graduate from uni by doing this you save over $30,000 depens more or less ---------- ako ne razbravte pak ke dojdam domavi i ke vi nacrtam na list
Thunder from down under	2005-2006 2007-2008
OooOo	quote: Originally posted by Thunder from down under ako ne razbravte pak ke dojdam domavi i ke vi nacrtam na list zemi si i flomasteri koa kje im idesh na gosti :)
dejan	quote: Originally posted by Legal-Eagle Dejan i made an informed post based on your fickleness on the forum. You either like being here or you dont. YOU LITTLE SNOB! How dare you say that working at McDonalds is beneath you and that interferes with your study... what it does do is teach you good time management skills and also gives you the opportunity to interact in a working enviroment. I am the managing director and CEO of several diverse companies and I NEVER EVER act all high and mighty, nor would i ever ask my staff to do anything that i would not do myself.Therefore i dont believe that any job is beneath me, i even am elected for staffroom duties (and I own the bloody company!!) I studied at university and worked with a law firm similtaneously and i believe that it taught me a lot more than just burying my head in my law books! Maybe you dont earn your first $100,000 in your first year, but by the 3rd year you are well on your way 'assuming' you hold the correct qualifications relevant to your chosen vocation. I like being here as i can interact with other Macedonians. Um....i have friends working friends that work at mcdonalds and hungry jacks, and as far as i know, they get told their hours 3 days before they have to work them. That is not good in my opinion, because my parents tell me that if i find a job, i should always put my study's before my work. I hope that you'll agree with me on this? Good for you if you own several companies. You live in Sydney right? Or Melbourne? Doesn't matter, but it must be easy to have obtained that high postion of yours in those cities. Here, not likely, as far as i know most people are racist as soon they see your last name or if they see that you have an accent. My mother gets rather annoyed when people say, 'you have an accent!' or 'sorry i can't understand you because you have an accent' Well what about the other australians that their own accents that i can't even understand! Are they ok people to employ? Or someone else who maybe would have had more experience than just Mcdonalds? Thunder i get where you are going. If you do a year in TAFE, and do the subjects that you might do at Uni then if you would like to go to Uni the next year, your subjects studied at TAFE would be recognised? Therefore you wouldn't have to do those subjects again? I think my sister's friend from Russia, she's here on exchange. I think she was doing some subjects at the Russo institue of Technology and at Uni she didn't have to do those subjects. I get where you are going at, and yes money is saved that way;) Damn will there be another way that Maco's will think of to save money? :p
cat	Za Legal Eagle: Ke dodam samo uste toa deka samata si pagjas v usta. Jas si stojam na ona sto go kazav prethodno za prosecnata zarabotuvacka deka e daleku ispod 100K. No ti po se izgleda go mesas prosekot so isklucocite. I jas znam poedinci sto zarabotuvaat i po 500K a ti tuka tvrdese deka sekoj so fakultet posle edna dve ili tri godini ke zarabotuva 100K, sto e sosem netocno. Verojatno dosega si zabelezala deka vo Avstralija ne e najvazno dali imas zavrseno fakultet, povekjeto od bogatite lugje ne si go gubele vremeto so kisnenje po fakulteti, golemite pari gi napravile so rabota i odenje vo presmetani rizici i investiranje, toa ne se uci na fakultet. Pretpostavuvam deka ti si edna od retkite visokoplateni isklucoci (plus fakultetski obrazovana), se nadevam deka stois zad ona sto go kazuvas za tvojata pozicija i ne se raboti samo za obicno duvanje baloni sto cestopati se zabelezuva megju nasincive. Na krajot ke dodadam deka ne e preporaclivo po sekoja cena da se odi na fakultet ili na TAFE. Ako saka covek da zaraboti sosema e dovolno i srednoto obrazovanie i mislenje so svoja glava. Skolata na zivotot ke te nauci povekje od fakultetot.
Legal-Eagle	Cat, I will have to agree with you on the best part of your post. It is true that some people who are earning a very comfortable living are those who have not had any formal education. Firstly my own father, secondly the likes of many of the self-made multi-millionares. That said, I want to stress that it is extremely hard to obtain any type of employment in today's workforce without any formal education. Society attaches a stigma to those who finish at a HSC level. It is a very rare case indeed, that a HSC school leaver becomes the CEO of a multi-national corporation. It just does not happen everyday. Further I will have to agree with the fact that NOT all university graduates earn up to $100,000 and beyond. But these people are more likely to do so than anyone else. Surely you would have to agree. That said, my income is no longer derived utilising neither my degree nor my masters, my income is derived from 65 years of hard work whereby the foundation was laid by both my Grandfather and father. I am sure that those to whom you are referring to that earn inexcess of $500,000 are people in their middle age or probably people who have inherited or carrying on a family business. My point is, education these days is VITAL to success in the workforce. I encourage all of my friends even those who have degrees to keep on learning and undertaking courses that would further their careers or better their chances of securing that "dream" job. Believe me those dream jobs do exist[:D] With reference to TAFE vs. University, i remain firm on my stance there and will not waiver. That is an undisputed fact, not just by me, but to most in NOT all to whom i have presented the question. To even employers who dont hold any formal qualifications (due to the nature of their business) would prefer a university graduate to a TAFE graduate. STIGMA? do i here you say? ABSOLUTELY! That is how society thinks, nor you nor I can change that, it is a preception that is here to stay for some time. Whether or not I agree is not of any real significance, but the fact remains the same. Most of my disdain was directed at dejan for his fickleness (a human characteristic i detest) nonetheless, the general banter that i have exchanged with you have been enjoyable. Cheers PS Just as a further point of interest. I think both you and I were being slightly extreme.You were pointing out the fact that you dont have to be educated at all to earn disgusting amounts of money, where i am adamant that you need to be educated if only to be employed or even have a shot at the $100,000. Please be mindful that today's success stories without any education are very few and far between. If you are a student, then i would encourage you to study to the best of your ability if you are a parent i am sure that you will encourage and support your children. It is about time this country owned a bit more brain power than brawn power.
Legal-Eagle	quote: I like being here as i can interact with other Macedonians. Um....i have friends working friends that work at mcdonalds and hungry jacks, and as far as i know, they get told their hours 3 days before they have to work them. That is not good in my opinion, because my parents tell me that if i find a job, i should always put my study's before my work. I hope that you'll agree with me on this? Good for you if you own several companies. You live in Sydney right? Or Melbourne? Doesn't matter, but it must be easy to have obtained that high postion of yours in those cities. Here, not likely, as far as i know most people are racist as soon they see your last name or if they see that you have an accent. My mother gets rather annoyed when people say, 'you have an accent!' or 'sorry i can't understand you because you have an accent' Well what about the other australians that their own accents that i can't even understand! Are they ok people to employ? Or someone else who maybe would have had more experience than just Mcdonalds? Dejan I do agree with you that at your age your studies should come before work. But that was not the reason you are feeling my wrath. The reason was because you said that working at McDonalds was NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR YOU! Well HELLO!!!!! Money earnt honestly is rewarding for the soul. A day of hard work never killed anyone (i kindly ask other readers not to share with us hard luck stories of people killed during the course of their employment it would really be in bad humour, thunder this is directed to you, because znam deka ke tresnis nekoj gluposti[:D]) I am sorry that you have been discriminated against because you have an accent. I truly believe those who are racist are in the vast minority as opposed to the majority. The whole jist of my point was to say the following 1 University is preferred to Tafe 2 Dont be so fickle (dont run with the foxes and hunt with the hounds) 3 Australia does NOT owe you anything, but it does give you the opportunities, it is up to you what you do with those presented to you 4 When all else fails, please do not rubbish our country and take the liberty at the first given chance and find another place of abode.
dejan	Hmmm ok ok, i got off at the wrong point when i said mcdonalds is beneath me. I wouldn't know, seeing as i haven't worked there... No need to be sorry, because it's no big deal:) I don't rubbish the country that much, only those that give me a bad impression of it. Yes i do recognise the opportunites that it gives me so i agree with you on that.
Thunder from down under	quote: Originally posted by Legal-Eagle [quote]The whole jist of my point was to say the following 1 University is preferred to Tafe my point was to stop people complaining about the price that have to be paid for universities ,and let them know there is another options going to tafe does not mean that you finished you education ,you still need to go to uni after you finished TAFE [;)] What do you want to study at uni Dejan? Are still intrested in that job for peeling patatoes at Mc Donalds ? [:D][:D]
Legal-Eagle	THUNDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![:(!] If he wants to learn how to peel potatoes he is kindly invited to my cooking class 101. I learnt that art at boarding school when i was on detention on afternoon. I had to help prepare dinner. BITCHES, and my parents use to pay tens of thousands of dollars for me to attend this bloody school. But i suppose it was worth every cent [:D] I am a great potato peeler. I think i can peel a complete potato in less than 10 seconds.[:D][:D][:D]
dejan	quote: Originally posted by Thunder from down under quote: Originally posted by Legal-Eagle [quote]The whole jist of my point was to say the following 1 University is preferred to Tafe my point was to stop people complaining about the price that have to be paid for universities ,and let them know there is another options going to tafe does not mean that you finished you education ,you still need to go to uni after you finished TAFE [;)] What do you want to study at uni Dejan? Are still intrested in that job for peeling patatoes at Mc Donalds ? [:D][:D] International business and another degree combined with it... Yeah i'm really interested in that macca's job Thunder:p Peeling potatoes is my future;) xexexexexe
Thunder from down under	quote: Originally posted by Legal-Eagle [:D] I am a great potato peeler. I think i can peel a complete potato in less than 10 seconds.[:D][:D][:D] TO get a job in Mc Donalds for peeling patatos you got to do better than that [:D]